In terms of long-term success, is there really something to a school defined as a premiere basketball school not being able to have a good football team on a consistent basis or is this a myth?
A few weeks back, was at a wedding with a grad school buddy who is originally from Indiana and his dad is a huge U of Indiana football supporter. Goes to every game, every year. When we were talking about this, a few things popped up in my head of possibly why, but before then let's break down some of the schools. I looked a the top ten highest winning percentage for D1 basketball programs and got this:
1.) Kentucky (0.764)
2.) North Carolina (0.736)
3.) Kansas (0.722)
4.) Duke (.707)
5.) UCLA (0.692)
6.) Syracuse (0.681)
7.) Louisville (0.665)
8.) Western Kentucky (0.664)
9.) St. Johns (0.652)
10.) Arizona (0.650)
Note that Notre Dame is just outside this list and of course that would have made a difference (also side note, was surprised Indiana is 19th on this ranking while being top 10 on overall wins). But with this top ten list for basketball programs, here is how they rank on the all time highest winning percentage for college football programs (noting some new additions to D1 have made these numbers a little bit skewed):
1.) Kentucky (94th)
2.) North Carolina (52nd)
3.) Kansas (97th)
4.) Duke (96th)
5.) UCLA (31st)
6.) Syracuse (39th)
7.) Louisville (77th)
8.) Western Kentucky (36th)
9.) St. Johns (NA)
10.) Arizona (45th)
The highest football rank for one of these schools is UCLA at 31st. You see a grouping of schools in the late 30s to early 50s and then again in the 90s for the most part. So some of these schools are having decent success (while noting a school like Syracuse is living off of success from decades ago), but not even having a school represented in the top 25 makes me think there is something to it. The two main reasons for this I can think of are:
1.) Lack of Resources
My biggest line of thinking here is that it is (or possibly more correct has been) financially impossible to support both a top tier football and basketball program. Perhaps it could be more that others just put more emphasis on football early on and the rest are playing catch up now, but it would make sense that the financials aren't there to support both. When you have a program with as much history as KU in basketball, it makes a lot of sense to preserve that, but at the same time I think this has hurt the development of the football program over the past few decades.
Lack of resources doesn't stop there as I also notice most of these schools are not exactly in areas with top tier football talent on a regular basis with the exception of UCLA and possibly North Carolina/Duke. It would certainly help to be in an area that produces studs on a regular basis
2.) Entitlement
Another part of me wonders if there isn't as much support for football (specifically in KU's case, may be true for others on this list) because of how successful the basketball program. Why support a team that hardly ever wins when you have a basketball team that wins all the time? People love rooting for winners. Now KU basketball is special and we all know that, certainly wouldn't want to hurt fan support for that program, but I can't help but wonder if we didn't have a program like KU basketball to root for, would there be more support for football?
When you look at the rest of the Big 12, they don't come close to matching us in terms of basketball prestige. There is some good schools that have some good years every now and then, but none of them are even close to KU when it comes to this (the next closest team on the top winning percentage list in the Big 12 is Texas at #22). So part of me wonders if fans of those programs support other programs more because they don't have a program like KU's basketball to lean on in tough times - on any given year they might, but not on a consistent basis...
There are probably a few more things (and please share your ideas), but I think those two things are the big 2 that has limited the growth of the football program. By now it is obvious it frustrates me that we don't have more people in the stands for football games. I know, we have sucked and people don't want to support programs that suck. But other schools do. I think you can easily argue other schools have better overall fans than we do. I want that to change. Continue supporting that great basketball program we have, but step up and be better fans as we need that going forward
A few weeks back, was at a wedding with a grad school buddy who is originally from Indiana and his dad is a huge U of Indiana football supporter. Goes to every game, every year. When we were talking about this, a few things popped up in my head of possibly why, but before then let's break down some of the schools. I looked a the top ten highest winning percentage for D1 basketball programs and got this:
1.) Kentucky (0.764)
2.) North Carolina (0.736)
3.) Kansas (0.722)
4.) Duke (.707)
5.) UCLA (0.692)
6.) Syracuse (0.681)
7.) Louisville (0.665)
8.) Western Kentucky (0.664)
9.) St. Johns (0.652)
10.) Arizona (0.650)
Note that Notre Dame is just outside this list and of course that would have made a difference (also side note, was surprised Indiana is 19th on this ranking while being top 10 on overall wins). But with this top ten list for basketball programs, here is how they rank on the all time highest winning percentage for college football programs (noting some new additions to D1 have made these numbers a little bit skewed):
1.) Kentucky (94th)
2.) North Carolina (52nd)
3.) Kansas (97th)
4.) Duke (96th)
5.) UCLA (31st)
6.) Syracuse (39th)
7.) Louisville (77th)
8.) Western Kentucky (36th)
9.) St. Johns (NA)
10.) Arizona (45th)
The highest football rank for one of these schools is UCLA at 31st. You see a grouping of schools in the late 30s to early 50s and then again in the 90s for the most part. So some of these schools are having decent success (while noting a school like Syracuse is living off of success from decades ago), but not even having a school represented in the top 25 makes me think there is something to it. The two main reasons for this I can think of are:
1.) Lack of Resources
My biggest line of thinking here is that it is (or possibly more correct has been) financially impossible to support both a top tier football and basketball program. Perhaps it could be more that others just put more emphasis on football early on and the rest are playing catch up now, but it would make sense that the financials aren't there to support both. When you have a program with as much history as KU in basketball, it makes a lot of sense to preserve that, but at the same time I think this has hurt the development of the football program over the past few decades.
Lack of resources doesn't stop there as I also notice most of these schools are not exactly in areas with top tier football talent on a regular basis with the exception of UCLA and possibly North Carolina/Duke. It would certainly help to be in an area that produces studs on a regular basis
2.) Entitlement
Another part of me wonders if there isn't as much support for football (specifically in KU's case, may be true for others on this list) because of how successful the basketball program. Why support a team that hardly ever wins when you have a basketball team that wins all the time? People love rooting for winners. Now KU basketball is special and we all know that, certainly wouldn't want to hurt fan support for that program, but I can't help but wonder if we didn't have a program like KU basketball to root for, would there be more support for football?
When you look at the rest of the Big 12, they don't come close to matching us in terms of basketball prestige. There is some good schools that have some good years every now and then, but none of them are even close to KU when it comes to this (the next closest team on the top winning percentage list in the Big 12 is Texas at #22). So part of me wonders if fans of those programs support other programs more because they don't have a program like KU's basketball to lean on in tough times - on any given year they might, but not on a consistent basis...
There are probably a few more things (and please share your ideas), but I think those two things are the big 2 that has limited the growth of the football program. By now it is obvious it frustrates me that we don't have more people in the stands for football games. I know, we have sucked and people don't want to support programs that suck. But other schools do. I think you can easily argue other schools have better overall fans than we do. I want that to change. Continue supporting that great basketball program we have, but step up and be better fans as we need that going forward
